The EDL

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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 10 Oct 2013, 03:20

I found out a bit more about that academic useful idiot who the BBC wheeled on straight after speaking to TR. He's left-leaning, writes for the Guardian and is soon to release a book about UKIP. Presumably this will attempt to smear them, but any more publicity will probably only help them.

As one person commented:

"This author is more a far-left propagandist for Islam than an academic. I think what's he's saying is that anyone who holds that Islam poses a threat to our country should be silenced. When he says "we need to take a more clever approach" he means the findings of any future poll will be tampered with until they produce the correct Islam-friendly results. It's basically taqiyya. The establishment used to execute traitors but now it welcomes them. Quite shocking really."


Even among the Guardian readership, this is stuff is evidently not believed any more, and those Islamophiles who actually make their living from turning traitor against their own culture (quislings) tend to be the most disliked of all.

Update: I will also include this comment from under the same article. I thought it was largely very good, except for the last paragraph, which I think took too rosy a view of mass immigration generally.

BruceForsyteSaga wrote:"Anyone who doesn't fear Islam, and that is what Islamophobia means, is a fool.

Islam has shown its propensity for violence right from its early days. It reacts with violence, committed in the name of Allah, at the slightest provocation. A cartoon, a book, a chat room comment. Even the death of a terrorist, by security services, before he or she can detonate their bombs prompts a violent response.

In Pakistan, blasphemy is punishable by death and is frequently carried out, not by the state, but by angry mobs objecting to some slight against Islam, the prophet or Allah. Two Government ministers were murdered for suggesting that the blasphemy law should be repealed. A young Christian girl with learning difficulties was 'framed' by someone in her community who accused her of burning pages of the Koran. She was arrested, tried and sentenced to death. Eventually she was released but then hounded out of her village and has had to seek refuge abroad.

The slaughter by Islamic terrorists continues on a daily basis. In this past week there have been terrorist attacks against Christians in Pakistan claiming 80 lives and scores more injured. Of course the awful and tragic events in Nairobi have yet to become completely clear. The body count stands at 70 dead and 200 injured. It will rise.

In Nigeria, Boko Haram, having enforced Sharia Law on the northern part of the country is seeking to extend this to the south. Africa is now the main fighting ground outside the middle east for Al-Q and its affiliated organisations.

These are just a few examples. So it is with surprise that only a "Quarter of young British people do not trust Muslims". This means that 75% do trust them. I would have expected the level of distrust to be much higher.
When a visitor comes to your house it is beholden of them to respect your views and way of life. Islam does not do this. It demands that we introduce halal food into schools, very often without telling non-Muslims that this is what their children are eating. It demands that we accept that women should be free to walk around veiled and then expect us to communicate with them. How many people would think it acceptable for the English to walk around dressed in KKK hoods?

The author seems to suggest that those who hold anti-Muslim feelings should be re-educated to ensure that they change their views. Perhaps he should instead ask the Muslim community to leave their tribal and religious customs, that have no place in our society.

This country is a country of immigrants. In the last 100 years we have seem people arrive here from all corners of the earth. Jews, Africans, Caribeans, Chinese, Indians, Eastern Europeans and many other variants plus nearly 3 million Muslims in less than 20 years. It is this latter group that has been the focus of so much attention and communal disharmony.
So I reject the authors view that its the locals who should welcome with open arms a hostile ideology."


The readership of the online Guardian may be a good deal brighter than those who actually buy the thing in hard copy. Well, those hard copies are ordered mainly by compromised public institutions (at taxpayers' expense, of course).
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Re: The EDL

Postby Elliott » 10 Oct 2013, 16:05

I'm about to listen to this Telegraph debate, between Dan Hodges and Tim Stanley. Wish me luck.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 10 Oct 2013, 16:19

In the introductory text alone they call the EDL "far-right", TR a "thug", and suggest there is something wrong with British nationalism. Comments closed again, too, so that no-one can oppose them. I turned it on - Stanley's priggish tones. I don't think I can take such a PC overload, Elliott. Please report back.

p.s. Tim's calling Tommy a "fascist" again here.

I notice they've got some balance in the studio too: "Left wing" blogger Sunny Hundal, Blairite journalist Dan Hodges and the anti-EDL Stanley himself. Oh, and not forgetting a woman from the Telegraph's "Wonder Women" department (that's really what they said)! Notably, they did not invite their colleage Norman Tebbit, a serious heavyweight, along.

I listened up to 2:12, effectively when the discussion began, and just couldn't listen any more, because this was not a debate about the EDL. As can be seen from my Tebbit link above, the EDL are not far right, yet Stanley kept on saying he was going to talk about "Britain's fascists". Since he did not mean the thousands of Muslims who are known to be plotting to kill us, I will not listen to him. Why are The Telegraph doing this? What is wrong with them? Perhaps they are deliberately trying to antagonise, lying, in some strange way in the hope of increasing sales. I don't buy The Telegraph anyway, nor do I see their ads, but I certainly won't buy it now.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 11 Oct 2013, 00:25

Here are some more comments from under this article. These are only a few - every comment I saw was actually in opposition to Mr Stanley...

garibalidi08 wrote:Nothing can describe the contempt I feel for this kind of empty headed journalism. Stanley in his world which he inhabits of 'chattering classes' round the Dinner Table ' I am Alright Jack ' nothing matters except the large media paycheck at the end of the month. This is about hatred toward those who have any opinions at all except those approved by the ruling elite which he considers himself part of. He is obviously angling for a post at the BBC or its House Newspaper.

'Tommy's EDL' was fascist because it rejected democracy in favour of street action'. Well that makes Suffragettes, Trade Unionists, Gay rights Activists, black Equality movements etc etc all Fascist then, doesnt it Mr Stanley?

Again he writes the EDL must be Fascist because of ' prejudice enforced by violence '. If Mr Stanley bothered to exam the files of his own newspaper he would find that there have been very few arrests for violence at EDL demonstrations. Indeed many arrests have occurred simply to protect the EDL from the so-called anti-Fascists who are mainly these days young radical Muslims. Or is he suggesting that EDL supporters have been racially attacking Muslims all over the country. In fact the opposite is the truth. In NO -GO Muslim areas violent racist attacks occur frequently and in increasing numbers against anybody and everybody especially women and gays.

What about the Muslim rape gang epidemic Mr Stanley ? Not important in your opinion ? Well to most who bother to study what is happening it is about Muslim expression of cultural and religious hatred to all who are non-believers.

Tommy and Kevin amongst others have gone out of their way to state that their sole purpose is to force the powers that be to act against Islamic Supremacism in all its forms. And the result the unabated villification from the entire Media. Well of course I understand you are under the thumb of the Hard-Left NUJ but it is still no excuse.
A small sop was thrown when you suggested that there was now a real choice because the Tories May be tightening up on immigration and UKIP have policies to restrict it. Ridiculous ! The threat from Islamic Supremacism is not going to go away and it is CERTAINLY NOT fascist in any form or another to say that.

Probably you like others in the elites have become so willfully blind in your defence of any aspect of the GREAT GOD Multi-Culturalism that any who dare to criticise must be Fascist by definition. I actually feel sorry for journalists like you because you will not out of fear wake up from your fantasy world!


essgeebee wrote:Tommy Robinson strikes me as a basically decent man, like many Britons sick to death of the institutional appeasement of Muslims that only encourages them to exhibit less and less tolerance of our own culture.


rogermurrayclark wrote:I see the this "thug-in-chief" thread is closed for comments

You'd expect this kind of Agitprop from the Guardian, but what has the Telegraph descended to?

One gets the feeling that the Westminster soft totalitarian regime is desperate for its latest squalid Black operation to succeed.

There may be some temporary relief, but a large proportion of the British public is never going to love and embrace diversity, not matter what Big Brother says and does.


freedomagainsttyranny wrote:Islam will be removed from the UK in the end.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Elliott » 11 Oct 2013, 05:16

Well, I listened to the mp3. To be honest it isn't that much. There's not much to it. It is nothing more than a lazy discussion of "fascism" by three men engaged in the cosy consensus that anybody who doesn't like mass immigration is a fascist.

Tim Stanley - who I am fast coming to regard as a complete and utter quisling, a man brimming with self-satisfaction such that he would sell out his own people, a man who in another age would certainly have been a Communist, not because he loved Communism but because he despised Britain - opens the discussion by saying that most members of the EDL probably couldn't spell "EDL". He also refers to Tommy Robinson as a "30 year-old hairdresser from Luton". Given what TR has done, what he's risked and what he's put up with over the last four years, for the "moderator" of the debate to speak of him in such terms reveals that this is going to be a woefully one-sided affair.

And it is. As far as Dan Hodges, Sunny Hundal and Tim Stanley are concerned, the one and only threat is and always was the EDL. It beggars belief that such a debate could be had in the same year as:

  • the Woolwich massacre (which is never mentioned, not once)
  • the Boston bombing (also never mentioned)
  • the Nairobi massacre (never mentioned)
  • the revelation that over 3,000 Muslims in Britain consider white Britons to be legitimate targets (never mentioned)
  • the succession of Muslim paedophile rings (never mentioned)
It also comes just a year after Britons learned (through a census that has been cancelled so that they will never learn again) that they are a minority in their own capital city.

To repeat, not one of the legitimate reasons for the EDL's existence is ever mentioned in the 17-minute debate. No, the threat is not Islam, it is not colonisation by Third Worlders, it is not multiculturalism, it is not Sharia, it is not child groomers, it is not a 1400-year legacy of warfare and genocide... it's the EDL. The EDL are the enemies of our way of life here in Britain - you know, like Eastasia has always been the sworn enemy of Oceania.

But there is reason for optimism about the threat constituted by the EDL and their evil fellow travellers. Hodges - part of a government which deliberately opened the floodgates so as to demographically and politically transform this country without its people's permission or knowledge - believes that "the far right" has had its day in Britain, that TR's leaving the EDL signals the end of the British opposition to mass immigration. Without any regret or reflection about the implications of the statement, he says that "demographic changes" will now ensure that the anti-immigration far right can never gain a hold again.

Sunny Hundal is more skeptical. Don't misunderstand - he is happy about the demographic changes, but he still doesn't trust the British public not to be racist. He thinks there is an element in the British public that is and always will be racist, and there is a need for constant vigilance in case "fascism" (now defined as being opposed to losing one's country to Third Worlders) rears its ugly head again. He does say, however, that this element of our society is "shrinking". It is shrinking, Sunny, and you'll make sure it shrinks even faster if your party gets in...
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 11 Oct 2013, 18:11

I have been reading about this move by TR and KC over at the Gates of Vienna. Apparently they are going to be "trained" in Islam by the government-funded Quilliam Foundation. I personally don't think they will break them, though. I think this is just a strategic move by Tommy to ease the pressure on himself, get rid of the court costs (possibly even the criminal trial), and appear more reasonable and credible. Also, as he said himself, a way of avoiding the problem of the few actual far-right people who have been troubling the EDL.

I thought I would reproduce some comments which stood out for me at GoV (I hope they will not mind me doing so):

Vortac wrote:I’ll quote Fjordman on this particular occasion:

“Are Islamic teachings inherently violent? Yes.
Can Islam be reformed? No.
Can Islam be reconciled with our way of life? No.
Is there such as thing as a moderate Islam? No.
Can we continue to allow Muslims to settle in our countries? No.”

These few sentences contain all the information about Islam you will ever need.


Julius O'Malley wrote:I do not doubt that Tommy Robinson and Kevin Carroll have been made offers they couldn’t refuse. The pressure from the Home Office would have been along the following lines: as you can see we can and will keep arresting and imprisoning you (including holding you in solitary confinement) [Tommy was put in solitary confinement for 18 weeks]. Perhaps you should consider deploying your energies into a more acceptable form. Have you heard of the Quilliam Foundation?

My assessment is that TR and KC will work within the organisation they have now joined to oppose “Islamism”, obtain insiders’ understandings of the workings of this Foundation, the nature and modus operandi of its personnel and its relationship with the government sector and media. In the fullness of time both men will emerge far more knowledgeable and effective members of the Counterjihad. I predict that down the track they will be instrumental in a highly damaging expose of the Quilliam Foundation or at least of its key people.

In addition to the “pull factors” there are the “push factors”: the EDL has naturally attracted a BNP element with the ugly baggage that element has carried long before Islam became an issue. TR has for several years wisely sought to root out that BNP element without success. I have no doubt he is sincere in that both ethically and for strategic reasons.

As to the use of a pseudonym by Tommy Robinson. There are several factors at play: he is a parent of three young children and thus first and foremost he must protect his children from harm. No sane person could doubt that his EDL activities place his children at a real risk of physical harm from the adherents of the Religion of Peace. No parent would hold it against him. The second factor is that whilst all double-barrelled names are problematic, “Yaxley-Lennon” is a doozy.

For those EDL supporting Brits disappointed in the recent actions of TR and KC, bear in mind this is not just about England and street demos, it is an international issue of long term concern requiring clever long term strategies.

As to Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer: both are useful and dedicated players in the international Counterjihad movement. The former is no doubt a massive egotist and self-promoter, but she is brave and does good work. The latter is, as far as I can tell, a paragon of sincerity and decency – an intellectual and ethical peer of the redoubtable Fjordman. The contribution made by Jihadwatch is second to none.


Porky's2istan wrote:All these comments and not one person has stated the obvious. The muslims, the BBC, and the orthodox UK left finally defeated Tommy Robinson.

He’s just a man. He has a family. He has a business, and he lives every day under an Osman Warning (a legitimate threat acknowledged by the police) in a country where you can’t even buy pepper spray, let alone a firearm. He’s not a millionaire. He can’t move from house to house every day. When a group of muslims followed a relative back to his house and threatened him with clubs and machetes. the police arrested HIM and did NOTHING to the muslims. Unlike Gert Wilders he doesn’t get 24 hour police protection. In fact, it seems as thought the police (and other agencies) are actively TRYING to get him killed. They made it a point to release his ‘real’ name, thus making it easier for assassins to find him.

Can you really blame the guy for giving up?

As far as this Quillian Foundation, I bet it’s his way of saying, ‘I quit. You win.’ I would bet that he doesn’t ever do anything meaningful for them other than let his name show up on their member roles. It allows him to fade into obscurity and, hopefully for his family, no muslim will murder him because they already have his symbolic defeat.

Maybe one of you critics would like to take his place? That is, if you are rich, don’t have a job, nor any friends, nor a spouse, nor children for the muslims to murder. You also have to not mind spending time in jail (with muslims) even when you’ve done nothing wrong and then spending a fortune in legal bills to prove it.

And you can do all this for a brainwashed idiot country that will spit on you for trying to save them from islamic tyranny, while muslims try to kill you, ‘anti-fascists’ throw bricks at you, and the police do NOTHING to stop either.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 11 Oct 2013, 20:17

Tommy Robinson was today assaulted - punched to the ground by an "Asian" in the street in his home town of Luton. The police have at least given him a crime reference number.

Here is one exchange about it - I'll refrain from posting the many odious comments from those gloating at the act of violence and wishing it had been fatal.

tommy.png
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 13 Oct 2013, 16:15

Regarding Nathan's earlier query, Paul Weston wrote this article regarding Tommy and Kevin joining Quilliam.

I don't trust Quilliam but I trust that Tommy and Kevin do not want their country Islamised, so we'll see what happens on that count in a few months. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the two were to emerge with inside information that Quilliam could not be worked with because of their adherence to the Quran. At the same time, Tommy will have, in one move, managed to avoid his legal troubles.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 19 Oct 2013, 16:48

Who is the real Tommy Robinson? I haven't bothered reading it as yet, but I liked the top comment:

wattys123 wrote:His town is getting overrun by an alien and aggressive culture, he stands-up to it and makes a difference. Anywhere else in the world the Left would love this indigenous hero, however, because he is getting in the way of the Left's social engineering in the UK they smear him with lies about racism. Anybody who wants to see England in 10 years should visit Luton.


Also a good comment by "Journeyman" there, who explains that when fighting an enemy ideology you don't stop to try to work out who is currently exercising that ideology most loyally and who isn't, you just resist it.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Elliott » 20 Oct 2013, 05:17

I also liked this comment:

Journeyman wrote:"does he understand that, by failing to make a distinction between Islam as a religion and the actions of certain Muslims, he has stigmatised an entire section of the British public."

Do you understand that it is not those "certain Muslims" who misunderstand or misinterpret orthodox mainstream Islam as it is written and meant to be understood by the officially recognised spokesmen and experts of orthodox mainstream Islamic jurisprudence? The "extremist" Muslim is just the one who applies it as it is actually written and taught and meant to be understood. It is the Western establishment political, media and academic elite who misunderstand Islam. They all rely on other Muslims as a source to advise them on team Islam's intentions. They believe that if Islam really did have any bad intentions towards the West and non-believers, it would come along, tap them on the shoulder and say "Hi, my name's Islam and we are a threat to your way of life".

Let me explain further the Western elite's catastrophic cognitive paralysis concerning Islam.

Let us take the mantra, "not all Muslims are terrorists". Well, not all Russians were revolutionary Bolsheviks, in fact only a small percent, but look what happened, 20 million died in camps. Not all Germans were Nazis, only about 6%, but look what happened. It is the sum total effect of Islam as a rival competing collective organism which matters. Islam cannot be understood through a Western psychological prism.

Islam is not a rational actor, and it is a major failure of cognitive understanding to attempt to react to Islam as 1.6 billion Muslims who we must judge on a one-by-one individual merit basis. Rival human collectives don't work like that, they work as rival human collectives have always done and that is as rival human collectives.

There is one other thing. Even if Islam imploded as a belief system tomorrow, it would not in the slightest make any difference to the coming territorial, cultural, and racial balkanisation and demographic cultural and social atomisation of the UK, Europe and North America.

When a soldier is in the trenches and sees the enemy charging across the field at him, he doesn't try to figure out who the nice enemy is and the bad enemy before firing his rifle just in case he accidentally stigmatises one of the "moderate" enemy. We are not at war against terrorism. No nation ever went to war against a tactic. We are at war against our own ruling political, media and intellectual elite and their monstrous, wicked, malicious, treasonous replacement level mass immigration policies.


Here's another one from the same guy. His style is flowery and verbose, but I think his conception of what is going on is very accurate:

Journeyman wrote:Muslims are just nature's way of telling us that third world mass immigration is a very, very, very bad idea. Establishment Left Political Correctness ( Cultural Communism--Multicult Liberalism) has unilaterally disarmed Western society's collective auto-immune threat recognition defences in a very competitive and group identity world.

Islam is a rival human collective organism. The non-Western world abides by the rules of Team Solidarity to protect and advance their team interests. Any whites anywhere who attempt to organise as a group to defend their team's economic, territorial, cultural and ethnic space are neutralised by the "fascist, nazi, bigot, racist, supremacist, hater" wordisms.

Nature is amoral. Nature does not give a crap about Liberalism. Nature does not have favourites or take sides. Demographics is your destiny. Nature only cares about who is having the most babies. Those who occupy the land own it.

Multiculturalism is a top-down imposed-from-above artificial social construct which bears no relationship to human nature and the world as it actually is. The consequences of the policies pursued by the Globalist & Left elite will be catastrophic for Western man.

No other group of humans in all of history have been tricked into collaborating in their own dispossession, disempowerment and replacement.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Nathan » 26 Oct 2013, 08:46

Graeme Archer refuses to condemn the EDL, but even so I think this piece doesn't go far enough.

It’s hard to say this, for fear of providing succour to racists


As if (white) racists, whatever that word is taken to mean, were the biggest source of all the unease in this country...
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 26 Oct 2013, 23:29

All of the comments (ordered by best rated) very interesting yet again, for example this exchange:

Screen Shot 2013-10-27 at 00.26.28.png
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Re: The EDL

Postby Nathan » 03 Nov 2013, 20:19

A London Underground worker who cut the bodies of victims from the mangled wreckage at Edgware Road station in the wake of the 7/7 bombings (and whose life seemed to have been ruined by the attack, if the article is accurate) gives his reasons for joining the EDL. The comments are overwhelmingly positive.
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Re: The EDL

Postby Gavin » 04 Nov 2013, 10:38

It's encouraging they let this be published, even though they lazily called the EDL "far right" again, as if they wish to put jackboots in Whitehall. Mostly they will just be working class people feeling culturally alienated and outnumbered in their own towns. Very satisfying to read the comments, too..
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Re: The EDL

Postby Nathan » 23 Jan 2014, 20:31

I don't know if the EDL are even active any more, but oh dear:

EDL founder Tommy Robinson jailed for 18 months for mortgage fraud

I hadn't heard anything about this until now. How many separate offences has this man been in trouble for now?
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