Multiculturalism

Islam is, for now, included under this topic

Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Elliott » 04 Feb 2014, 00:38

That kind of thing, if made about Britain, would make my blood boil.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Alf » 04 Feb 2014, 00:46

In one of the comments to the The Economist article "The Downside of Diversity" there is mention of another very interesting article written in 2008. It is "Us and Them: The Enduring Power of Ethnic Nationalism" wriiten by Jerry Z. Muller on the Foreign Affairs website. It can be found at
http://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/63217/jerry-z-muller/us-and-them
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Alf » 04 Feb 2014, 01:06

Here's another article from the comments about a study in 2007 about the negative effects of diversity:
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/ideas/articles/2007/08/05/the_downside_of_diversity/?page=full
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Connor » 05 Feb 2014, 06:04

Nathan wrote:
I'm curious, Connor, do you live in New York City itself or just New York state? NYC must be a very hard place to live in for a conservative who's not too fond of multiculturalism.


I do, in fact, live in New York City. On weekdays, I work right in the center of midtown Manhattan, which could be considered "the belly of the beast." I'll let you insert your own definition of "beast" here (commerce, pop culture, diversity, etcetera).

As for a home, I currently live by myself in a neighborhood in the borough of Queens. The area is rather clean and safe, and it's populated mostly by SWPL types. Though I can't really count myself as being part of that tribe (to them, my views would be abhorrent!), I suppose I can pass as one of them in terms of appearance. Anyway, my neighborhood is one of the areas that is rapidly being subjected to "gentrification," which I think is a very good thing (and I suspect many of my neighbors secretly agree).

You're right that it can be difficult to live in this city with the views that I possess. I suppose I can't complain excessively, though, because I willingly moved here several years ago, and that was before I had any fully-formed ideas about multiculturalism. In fact, I think that living in such a city is a large part of what caused me to question "diversity" in the first place. There are definitely some parallels with my own experiences and those that Gavin and Elliott had in London, I believe.

Nathan wrote:
At least in London I could reasonably suspect that most native white Londoners really were thinking what I was thinking when we were sitting on the bus surrounded by half a dozen different phone conversations in unidentifiable foreign languages, even if they kept quiet about it, and we don't have affirmative action, white guilt and identity politics shoved down our throats over here as much as you do in America.


Interesting that you should say that about London, and Britain in general: I read so much about the dire state of your country on this forum, but I should remember that some things might be even worse over here!

Your experiences with public transportation are different from mine, I must say. My daily commute on the subway is a fairly alienating ordeal. Typically, I just get onto the car and bury my head in a book for 20 minutes until it's time to get off. The car is usually filled to the brim with people, but they're all from different countries and cultures, and consequently, everyone pretty much stays silent. It's not nearly as exciting as the Coca-Cola commercial that Andreas linked to above.

So I don't really have that unspoken understanding with "native white" people that you mention. Actually, when I do encounter such a person on the subway, they tend to stand out. If I see someone who looks "Middle American" (which I would roughly define as someone who looks white, middle-class and suburban), then I tend to wonder what they're doing there. That might sound odd, seeing that I come from the same such background myself. I suppose that's just an effect of becoming jaded.

On the other hand, it is possible to find homogenous enclaves in New York City. Most neighborhoods are still generally divided along ethnic lines. Here's a map of NYC below that demonstrates this fact:

Image

Also, people tend to create their own social networks, and the people that comprise them usually end up being from similar backgrounds. That's at least certainly true for me, as I'm mostly friends with ex-Middle American types who decided to move to New York City at a certain point in their lives.

But should we have moved here? Should I have moved here? That's a question I've been asking myself a lot lately. I'm still not sure of the answer. But let's just say that, one day, I might make the same choice that you, Gavin and Elliott ultimately made. Then I'll move back to somewhere that has less of, well, a "downside."
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Gavin » 10 Feb 2014, 21:05

I don't think I have the time or energy to write the post, but here is the scene in a laundrette I visited in the Midlands. I couldn't understand the conversation of anybody in there.

20140208_114302.jpg


Except one black man, to whom I made the mistake of saying "Well I put my whites in one machine my coloureds in the other".
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Elliott » 11 Feb 2014, 04:17

Gavin wrote:Except one black man, to whom I made the mistake of saying "Well I put my whites in one machine my coloureds in the other".

I know Internet slang is discouraged on this forum, but I just have to say "LOL, LOL, LOL"! How did the guy respond?

As for the photo, the woman in the middle looks like Bela Lugosi!
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Andreas » 12 Feb 2014, 19:58

my neighborhood is one of the areas that is rapidly being subjected to "gentrification," which I think is a very good thing (and I suspect many of my neighbors secretly agree).


For the liberal/left, gentrification in American cities is of course a bad thing. Just today the Guardian has included a blog post by a woman in Oakland, California who identifies herself as an Afro-Latina woman, but acknowledges that she has "privilege in this society over people who have darker skin, less education, a less respected job, and less money." For our edification, she has outlined 20 ways not to be a "gentrifier" (I guess you can add this to the list of evil things one can be, like racist, sexist, neocolonialist, genderist, ageist, etc...).

http://www.theguardian.com/cities/2014/ ... gentrifier

Mostly it's laughable and needs no commentary, but I can't help but react to the following:

Smile and say hi to your neighbors every time you see them, even if they seem scary or don't say hi back


What if they ARE genuinely scary and threatening?

2. Recognize all the people outside of your door as your neighbors, even if they look different from you and live under different circumstances. This includes the homeless who sleep rough, the drug dealers who sell outside the liquor store, and the prostitutes walking your streets. Replace the words homeless, drug dealer, and prostitute with the word neighbor. Treating these folks with respect and dignity from the beginning will give you later leverage to talk to them about changing their behavior and getting out of the life.

3. Change the way you look at these neighbors by changing the language you use to describe them. Think about the motivations for their actions. Instead of "that prostitute was out all night selling her body", think: "My neighbor (insert name here) was forced by her pimp to stand out in the cold all night and have sex with multiple men she didn't know." See if that doesn't change your opinion of her.


This is a strange new twist on Orwellian language manipulation.

5. Really think before you call the police. Ask yourself, is this something that can be fixed by a simple conversation? Did a violent crime just happen? Then, of course you should call the police!

But your neighbor playing their music too loud is not a police issue. Remember many communities have experienced, and still experience, real trauma at the hands of the police. While you may think a person has nothing to fear if they didn't do anything wrong, an African-American person will always be holding Oscar Grant and Alan Blueford in their mind. A simple interaction with the police can trigger the collective PTSD from which the entire community suffers.

6. Remember low-income communities and communities of color are suffering from hundreds of years of historic trauma, and this trauma is very fresh in the minds of most Oaklanders.


If the neighbors are playing music too loud I guess they must just be expressing themselves and we should be culturally sensitive. The people this writer says are suffering from hundreds of years of historic trauma probably don't have much solid knowledge of history.

7. Recognize most of the perpetrators of crime in Oakland have also been the victims of a system you have benefitted from disproportionately.


As Dalrymple has written in many places, this attitude disregards the other low-income people in the neighborhood who are most often the victims of violent crime.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Gavin » 24 Feb 2014, 20:30

I never got back to you about your question, Elliott. Very busy with work these days. The guy was quite cool about it, not sure he was really clear on what I was saying, actually. He had a very strong Nigerian accent.

Birmingham is not like anything I have ever known, even in London. You see hundreds of burqas and hijabs. It just isn't the UK culture any more. It's alien. Yet sometimes people of these completely different cultures are kind, sometimes they are decent people. It's making me think (more). How can this be avoided? Can it really realistically be avoided in the age of air travel? I am afraid not.

I am starting to think there will be a degree of multiculturalism and there is nothing we can do about it, we must just insist on truth and decency, and the problem is these values effectively exclude Islam. Liberal do-gooders ought to concentrate their fire much, much more, also on the self-segregation of "communities" and the racism from them (such that they will sometimes kill their children if they date infidels). The British have actually been very, very tolerant of what is going on and of what has happened to their country.

I have said before that laws currently protect us. If Islamists and other third world people break the law they can be locked up. The problem is rather the cowardice and political correctness of authorities, and the very real danger that many young Muslims are hardening in their faith rather than integrating, and thus will demographically and democratically threaten those laws themselves. No-one seems to know how this will end up.

What will countries be, if mass immigration continues, also? They certainly won't be ethnically defined. They will be defined by values and language, or perhaps not at all. This is complex matter, and that's all I have time to write for now.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Nathan » 27 Feb 2014, 18:30

Oh dear.

Net migration to the UK jumps 30% in a year to 212,000

One silver lining is that the three largest contributors to that figure, Poland, Spain, and Italy, are all what you could consider "friendly" countries, and non-European immigration is down. It's a wonder why so many still want to come here, given how employment prospects and the general consensus regarding immigration make us a much less welcoming destination than 8-10 years ago.

How many more extra people will we end up with if Labour get back in again next year?
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Paul » 07 Mar 2014, 21:23

I see that there's yet another investigation into the Metropolitan Police in relation to the Stephen Lawrence case. The Police have already been branded 'institutionally racist' because of this case, well highlighted by TD more than once. Now it's something to do with corruption. The victim's mother and her 'community' won't be satisfied until they've emasculated and dis-empowered the London Police entirely. And then what?

Today, in a newspaper I read .....' Baroness Lawrence in angry scenes at the House of Lords yesterday....'

Some kind of trouble then. Now who would have imagined that?

Let that sink in ....The House of Lords.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Elliott » 08 Mar 2014, 03:53

It just amazes me how the Lawrence thing goes on and on and on... just when you think it must have run out of steam, it pops up again. It's the wound that is never allowed to heal. And as for Doreen Lawrence being in the House of Lords, it would be a joke if it wasn't so insulting.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Gavin » 16 Mar 2014, 17:36

BBC Radio 4 is (amazingly) currently running a programme on electoral fraud in the UK, which happens almost exclusively in "Asian communities" (they don't mean Chinese), in favour of the Labour Party. They're being ever so sensitive about it but can't hide the truth.

It's sad to hear native British people coming on for interview and knowing that they are being defrauded and denied even governing parts of their own country by immigrants. They are saying that it is very difficult to get to the bottom of the problem because the "communities" (mainly Pakistanis) are closed to outsiders and speak their own languages. They're growing rapidly, too.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Gavin » 24 Apr 2014, 08:46

David Cameron recently called Britain "a Christian country", but this is surely whistling in the wind when the reality of demographics tells a different story. The country is now hardly even culturally Christian.
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Gavin » 24 May 2014, 12:37

A police chief says "far right" groups should be banned from staging protests because each one costs £500,000 to police.

Meanwhile, even the BBC reports that more than £140m per year is spent on translation services for migrants alone, not to mention health care and benefits payments, while those who do work (e.g. Poles) tend to "send money home".
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Re: Multiculturalism

Postby Gavin » 08 Jun 2014, 13:46

I think these videos (which we have noted before) really get to the point of the problem with multiculturalism and expose how destructive it is.



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