Why get tattooed?

Examples of social decline, especially in the UK

Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Grant » 26 Jan 2014, 08:40

Nathan, thank you for the concession that the British flag as part of another country's flag is arcane. I am a traditionalist on most things but our current flag sends the message we're still dependent on Mother England. Our English heritage is something of which we should be proud and grateful for but the time has come for the relationship to have matured to the extent where Australia should have a flag of its own. If this ever occurs, it will cause some consternation amongst the ranks of those who include the Australian flag in their body art collections.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Yessica » 26 Jan 2014, 09:19

Grant wrote:People who lead lives devoted to contribution and commitment don't need the approval of or attention from others. Their innate self-respect and humility, as opposed to self-esteem, are the basis for the moral compass by which they live.


I would really like to disagree. Introverted people might not need it, but extroverted people do need feedback /encouragement from others. Think also of the fact that we live in a world, were recklessness / thuggish behaviour is encouraged by the media.
I often comment on people doing their job well... especially if is an ill-paid job. I also comment on people being friendly with their children and so on.

A few days ago for example I met a guy who was a medical student as I could see from a sticker he had on his backpack. I used to opportunity to tell him that I think it is really important what he is doing.

I sometimes have people telling me they think I am doing an important job as a wife and mother. It means a lot to me... that does not mean that I don't love to be a mother or that I am trying my best just for peoples praise. Only a very shallow person would do that.
I can understand why Dalrymple "hates" people who have the name of their child tattooed but could not care less about that child. This is indeed something to be deeply ashamed of.

Let's get back to the medical student. Do you think he should not have this sticker? Why not? To be a medical student is something to be proud of, he worked hard for it, you will make peoples life better. The job requires much of self-denial and service mentality.
Why not say: Hey, I am very proud of serving my community as a medical doctor?
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Charlie » 18 Jun 2014, 07:32

"Some convicts are on the pitch...they think it's all over..."

Shame on the Daily Telegraph.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Mike » 18 Jun 2014, 08:12

Ha...during Australia's first game at the tournament (against Chile) I was given a fresh reason for cheering for my countrymen when I saw that pretty much the whole Chilean team had arms covered hand to shoulder in tattoos.

We still lost.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Nathan » 18 Jun 2014, 08:45

Hah, that's my English allegiance out of the window then!
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Charlie » 18 Jun 2014, 09:15

It’s impossible to escape them, isn’t it?

From Chile to Algeria to Iran - the tattoos often stand out more than anything else.

The Dutch players, in particular, look like they should be stalking around maximum security institutions. Especially De Jong. Except his first name is Nigel, which tends to lessen his “hard man”/“warrior” pretensions.

The French and the Italians, though, all have about five haircuts each and terrible tattoos (ok, that’s a tautology), which just looks comical.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Charlie » 19 Aug 2014, 20:09

A friend of mine had an interesting story to tell me about a job interview he went to recently. It was for an IT position (of sorts) and the company (whose name I shall not mention) prides itself on being a fantastic place to work.

Anyway, my friend arrived suited, booted and clean shaven.

There were three interviewers: one man and two women, but it was the male who caught my friend’s attention.

The man must have been around thirty years old, but he was dressed in a t-shirt and jeans (!). Moreover, the sleeves on his t-shirt were sufficiently short to show off the large, ugly tattoo on his arm and he had 2-day stubble!

My friend couldn’t believe it…

Why bother trying to look one’s best for an interview if the interviewer turns up in a t-shirt, jeans and a tattoo on his arm?

Life in the UK can really seem like a race to the bottom at times, can’t it?
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Nathan » 19 Aug 2014, 20:16

Self-employment...:p
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Kevin R » 19 Aug 2014, 21:25

Charlie wrote:A friend of mine had an interesting story to tell me about a job interview he went to recently. It was for an IT position (of sorts) and the company (whose name I shall not mention) prides itself on being a fantastic place to work.

Anyway, my friend arrived suited, booted and clean shaven.

There were three interviewers: one man and two women, but it was the male who caught my friend’s attention.

The man must have been around thirty years old, but he was dressed in a t-shirt and jeans (!). Moreover, the sleeves on his t-shirt were sufficiently short to show off the large, ugly tattoo on his arm and he had 2-day stubble!

My friend couldn’t believe it…

Why bother trying to look one’s best for an interview if the interviewer turns up in a t-shirt, jeans and a tattoo on his arm?

Life in the UK can really seem like a race to the bottom at times, can’t it?


My wife occasionally interviews potential job candidates at the company she works for (retail fashion). She once interviewed a young girl of about nineteen, who turned up in dirty dishevelled clothing, and all through the entire interview stared over the my wife's shoulder at the blank CCTV screen cameras. The first two questions put to her were:

Have you had any experience working in retail?'

"..Erm.. no.."

"What do you think is the most important quality to have in a job in fashion retail where you deal with customers on a daily basis..?"

" Erm.. Oh.. f**k.. I dunno.."
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Paul » 19 Aug 2014, 21:47

Nathan wrote:Self-employment...:p


Agreed.

How are people coping out there? On the one hand there are nowhere near enough jobs to go round. On another, many of them are non-jobs. Of the remainder, it seems that everyone is treading on egg-shells in adherence to some kind of Marxist doctrine. How is any work getting done?
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Gavin » 16 Sep 2014, 17:37

One thing I think is quite strange is when you get someone who seems otherwise civilised but who you then notice has tattooed themselves. I find this kind of thing quite valuable as it reminds you that there is much more to a person than first meets the eye (or ear): they can seem composed and intelligent on the outside, but if they've tattooed themselves that's always a sign to me of probable inner turmoil, ill judgement and unpredictability, no matter how well well spoken or gentle they might seem to be.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Paul » 16 Sep 2014, 22:59

Gavin wrote:One thing I think is quite strange is when you get someone who seems otherwise civilised but who you then notice has tattooed themselves. I find this kind of thing quite valuable as it reminds you that there is much more to a person than first meets the eye (or ear): they can seem composed and intelligent on the outside, but if they've tattooed themselves that's always a sign to me of probable inner turmoil, ill judgement and unpredictability, no matter how well well spoken or gentle they might seem to be.


I would make an exception to this, at least historically, for people who have been in the military and (certainly historically now) men who worked in mass-employment heavy industry. Tattoos in these cases would not necessarily be for thuggish, or alternatively narcissistic reasons.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Nathan » 01 Oct 2014, 10:07

I randomly came across a text about tattooing in pre-Christian Germanic Europe and thought it might be of interest here, though I don't know if it is all true:

Tribal tattoos were originally tribal identifiers, and although these symbols are still tattooed today, much of the knowledge about their origins and meanings has been lost. The reason why the knowledge of their meanings was lost has its roots in the policy of conquest once practised in Europe. The native peoples were forcibly converted to Christianity and banned from observing their traditions and rites. Tribals fulfil a variety of purposes, which differ between the various tribes but still share a lot in common.

Tribal tattoos are status symbols and were often done to commemorate certain events, e.g. after a successful hunt, getting married, or the birth of a child. The members of the tribe wore their tattoos with pride and were treated with respect. Tribal tattoos therefore serve to identify the wearer with their tribal forefathers. Most of all, tribals are an important way of connecting with one's roots after the ban on tribal tattoos that lasted for a number of generations. Tribals were said to ensure that the soul stays in the body whilst the wearer is asleep, and doesn't disappear into the spirit world. If the soul was attacked in the spirit world and couldn't get back into the body soon enough, it could result in the death of the wearer.


Personally I don't like the very idea of marking one's skin - even the idea of writing something on the back of my hand makes me shudder - but I have more sympathy for tattoos back then if there was a genuine belief system surrounding them. The bolded bit though sounds so contemporary it makes me laugh!
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Alf » 01 Oct 2014, 22:36

Just thought I would share this on the original reason for tattoos in a particular society, the Maori, of Polynesia:

THE MAORI ART OF MOKO by Margaret Orbell
THE ART of moko—or tattoo, to use the pakeha (English) word...In the old days... It was a sign of aristocratic birth; as James Cook noted in 1762, tattooing was ‘peculiar to the principal men among the New Zealanders’. It would have been quite impossible for a slave, or any other person of low birth, to aspire to possess a moko on his face, although practically all men except slaves were tattooed from their knees to their waist.

Another early traveller, the Frenchman Dumont d'Urville, wrote in his diary that ‘A New Zealander one day examining the seal of an English officer, noticed the coat of arms engraved on it and asked him if the design was the moko of his family’. And Te Pehi Kupe, whose facial moko is on the inside cover of this issue of ‘Te Ao Hou’, said much the same thing when he explained to his English friends that the marks on his forehead represented his name. He also drew for them the corresponding forehead marks — the ‘names’ — of his brother and son.

Even though we have no really adequate explanation of the full meaning of moko, its general significance is clear. Distinguished families possessed marks which belonged to themselves alone, and these were handed down from father to son. Always, though, there were differences; no two moko were ever the same, and the designs allowed for infinite variations.

A famous man's moko would be known far and wide, by his friends and by his enemies...

Wearing a moko was like having your name written on your face in very beautiful writing. It was also a way of showing that you had reached adulthood, for it was only at puberty that boys and girls were allowed to be tattooed. No girl of good birth was regarded as fit for marriage until this was done, and until then, no boy could consider himself a proper warrior, a person of some consequence in his village.

So they endured the terrible pain stoically, sustained by their pride and by the knowledge that henceforth, they were no longer children: they were men and women. In this way, the ceremony of tattooing served as an initiation rite: as the sign of their transition from one role in society to a different role. All so-called ‘primitive’ societies (that is, societies, such as that of the Maori, which did not possess a written language or an elaborate technology, and which lived in comparatively small social groups), had initiation rites of some kind. They served the purpose of bringing home to the boys and girls concerned, and to their relatives and fellow villagers, a sense of the importance and finality of their change of status. Usually, as with the Maori, the initiation rites were accompanied by prayer and pain, and by a permanent visible sign of their new place in society.

This was why slaves could have no moko, unless, of course, they had been captured as prisoners of war. The moko was a mark of a man's or woman's position in society; but a slave, by definition, had no place in society.
Men who were not slaves, but who were of undistinguished ancestry, wore the moko from their waist to knees, but did not have it on their faces. Probably, this was because the head, being tapu, was especially important as a mark of distinction.

The only important men who did not wear a moko were the tohunga, or priests. The writer does not know of any tradition telling why this was so, but it seems likely that it was a consequence of the prohibition against shedding the blood of a tohunga.
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Re: Why get tattooed?

Postby Kevin R » 02 Oct 2014, 00:21

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