The breakdown of the family

Examples of social decline, especially in the UK

The breakdown of the family

Postby Gavin » 10 Aug 2012, 09:42

One thing that feminism has been very successful at achieving, of course, has been the breakdown of the family. The feminists have made it an economic necessity for many women to work now, whether they want to or not. It's funny how now the newspapers dare to write of women "not needing to work", whereas hitherto it was their "right".

While it has played a leading role, there isn't only feminism to blame in this, of course. Other factors have been influential, such as the decline of religious belief (particularly among the less intelligent, who cannot see how to live).

The British citizen has had to become an expert on bizarre family structures, which are now normal. I used to find it hard to get beyond brother and sister. Now it's all "half-brothers" and step families.

Let's take as an example the family of missing schoolgirl Tia Sharp - this family is typical of those in many British cities and certainly of those in the area in which I live. Dealing just with the grandmother's boyfriend (already somewhat unconventional) this man first of all was dating the girl's mother, then moved onto the grandmother. It wouldn't surprise me in modern Britain if both were being dated concurrently, even with each other's approval. The man, covered in tattoos, as is normal, has served two jail sentences: one for selling crack cocaine and one for possessing a machete.

What needs to happen now is the social services need to be under investigation for why they allowed this young girl to be in the company of this kind of individual at all. In another country, perhaps, not in Britain - we can dream.

We live in a country where a crack addicted woman can have six or seven children, with each next one planned to be taken away by the social services before it is even born, yet nothing can be done about this. We need to get harder in my view - cut benefits and think about possible sterilisation of the underclass if they prove themselves to be so irresponsible. Instead, they can expect decent houses to be provided to them if they get pregnant - I have seen this myself. The encouragement of the breeding of the stupid and indolent is obviously a recipe for disaster for society which is going to have to be taken in hand at some point.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Heather » 12 Aug 2012, 00:35

Sorry I can't do a full reply right now, I just thought it was hilarious that a man can be imprisoned for possessing a machete, after this story:

When my husband and I were dating, he took me to a Halloween party at the house that he had lived in the previous summer. One of his former housemates was dressed as some colonial African explorer, and had a machete as part of the costume. He was trying to open a bag of chips with his hands, and it wasn't working, so my husband, trying to be funny and thinking the thing was a plastic prop, took the machete and attempted to spear the bag open with it. The friend said, "Dude, that's a real machete. I got it from the supermarket today for ten dollars. It's actually pretty sharp."

I guess that's America's Midwest for you! Funny how you don't ever hear about machete attacks, though.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Elliott » 02 Nov 2012, 00:33

New report from the ONS.

  • number of households in Britain has increased by 10% since 1996
  • number of unmarried couples living together has doubled since 1996
  • number of kids being raised by unmarried couples has doubled since 1996 to 2 million
  • number of gay couples bringing up children has trebled in 2 years
  • percentage of kids being raised by married parents has fallen from 75% in 1996 to 60%
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Grant » 15 May 2013, 12:04

I am surprised this topic hasn't received greater input from members. As a teacher, I see daily the deleterious effects of one parent families on the lives of children. Too many children, especially boys, are left to grope their way to adulthood without a significant male figure. The worst offenders are the mothers who have multiple children to multiple partners. The government (Australian) has contributed to this deplorable situation with the "baby bonus", giving mothers $5,000 for each newborn child. This has only encouraged an increase in the birthrate of that section of society that can least afford more children. This bonus has been renamed the "Plasma TV bonus" or the "overseas holiday bonus" as that's where the money goes. Does Britain have a similarly ludicrous scheme?
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Gavin » 15 May 2013, 14:46

They were talking about this on an earlier LBC radio phone-in, Grant. If I can give some context: they had just conducted an interview the female Chief Constable of Oxfordshire police about the Muslim child rape scandal, they urged people to phone in, and then, suddenly, they completely changed the subject after only one call had been received. I dare say there was a torrent of calls, none of which they could put on air because they were too truthful.

To her credit, the presenter, Julia Hartley-Brewer, questioned the competence of the parents of the errant children, though (probably under instruction) she steered well clear of the obvious Islamic element to the story. She also asked the Chief Constable why she should not resign, to which the latter replied with talk about about lessons having been learned, etc, and she was the best person to "go forward". Of course, she should be sacked, but more than likely won't be. Like I say, I think the calls were probably just "too hot". I suppose there will be a lot more of this censorship as things move forward but still people will vote for what they believe in.

Anyway, to your point, they have gone on to talk about "male identity" post-feminism. Again Julia HB pointed out that it is acceptable today for men to be slapped and ridiculed on television (routine in commercials) whereas similar treatment of women would cause an public outcry (yet the two are supposed to be equal).

It seems many young women today just typically laugh at men and see them as somewhat pathetic (well, they know they have the upper hand through PC so they can do what they like). These women don't seem to be remotely soft or sensitive - they don't seem to want love. First and foremost they want power - they bought what feminism sold them. Yet they cannot ever, in reality, really equal men when push comes to shove (engineering, army), and secretly they do want a strong guiding man, so we have this absurd, fabricated situation in which everyone suffers - especially the children.

Many boys growing up probably hardly have any men in their lives now. Almost no primary school teachers are male, the mothers will be single (usually due to their own fault - choosing an obvious thug while side-lining decent men because they're were not "exciting"), and yes, the women will repeatedly get pregnant by different men. But woe betide the person who ventures that this was their own fault. Heresy! Remember, it is the man's fault always - he is, after all, a man.

I think - no, I know - women have been over-indulged and it is time they were held accountable for their own actions. I personally know examples of women who have repeatedly got themselves pregnant by obvious thugs and been richly rewarded by the state as a result. Whether there are large cash bulk payments for doing so, as you describe, I don't know, but we do have regular child benefits and homes are provided to irresponsible women (very nice new ones sometimes).

From what I can gather from the underclass in my area (I live at the moment in a predominantly UC area) there is a whole myriad of benefits available: these people often compare notes and make sure they are playing the system for all it is worth - it becomes their job. They probably wonder at the stupidity of the people who give them so much money, unless they just take it for granted. I have heard them in the street advising each other to get this, that, and the next benefit. This is never accompanied by any talk of the possibility of working.

We do have a crisis caused by rampant feminism (political correctness) and indulgence of the coarsest most unintelligent people, I think, and it will bring our society down economically (if not otherwise) unless it is turned around.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Caleb » 16 May 2013, 01:57

Grant: I haven't written anywhere near as much as I could because I could fill a tome.

I worked at a school in rural Victoria once where it was literally a case of one town, six surnames. There was a booklet with a list of contact names and phone numbers. A quick glance at the booklet was like playing connect the dots. Sally Smith was living with Mary Brown, who was the mother of Jason Brown-Jones, who lived with Lucy Wills who was married to Simon Smith...

I can't remember if I've told any stories about these kids before, but there were two boys at our school who were always in trouble. The thing was that punishing those kids was like water off a duck's back because their father/step-father would beat them at home. Absolutely nothing I said or did so much as elicited a raised eyebrow, let alone a complaint, from the kids. They always turned up to lunchtime detentions or anything else, but no disciplinary measures had any effect upon them at all. They absolutely freaked me out. I wouldn't be surprised if you see those guys on the news as serial killers in ten years' time.

It turned out that their father/step-father and mother/step-mother were both on their second marriage, and had five kids from those marriages between them. They were both on welfare. In a twisted way, the father did have a certain sense of financial savvy about him. After all, he wouldn't let me keep his kids after school for detention unless I would drive them home because they would miss the school bus, and then he'd have to drive 40km in each direction to pick them up. He was clearly thinking of their home economy. Likewise, who could argue with a man who wouldn't buy his kids toothpaste because it was too expensive? Though he would buy them several slabs (a pack of 24) of soft drink each week. Being a man who understood the value of money, I'm sure he was smart enough to buy only the supermarket brand. Let it also be said that the underclass get a bad rap in terms of being able to delay instant gratification. He and his wife were, after all, saving the thousands of dollars required for a vasectomy reversal, so they could have a mutual child, their sixth between them.

Furthermore, he knew how to instill a sense of responsibility and honouring a commitment into his sons. The eldest broke his wrist punching a locker one day and two teachers had to take him to the hospital. When informed that his son would require a cast on his arm, his father (by telephone of course -- why waste the petrol driving 80km?!) gently reminded his son, nay convinced him with rational and well reasoned arguments, that he had a cricket match that weekend. The boy didn't get the cast. Frankly, the more I learnt about the man, the more I was inspired. I did, of course, readily look forward to all interactions with him.

Well, I guess at least he and the boys' mother/step-mother were married. That's something, isn't it?

Sometimes, I feel a bit guilty thinking or talking about these kinds of people. It's a bit voyeuristic.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Grant » 16 May 2013, 11:16

Caleb, when confronted by similar exotic relationships my comment to staff is "we surely must lead dull lives but dull is good!" This constant passing parade of partners boggles the mind but more importantly warps the children's concept of what a stable, loving relationship is. We allow children to be exposed to this selfishness and then expect they will become the citizens who'll in turn raise their offspring in wise ways.
The desire of child protection authorities to keep fractured families together regardless of the toxicity of the family dynamic is of great concern. If I had a dollar for every child from a dysfunctional family who's experienced significant problems, I would be a rich man.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Gavin » 16 May 2013, 11:49

I think large well-run institutions should be established to more readily take children away from dysfunctional parents. I agree that the "staying with the parents" factor is not of the paramount importance the Left would have us believe.

Just imagine it - they go off to a kind of boot camp (maybe the army itself). They're taught discipline, self-discipline, camaraderie, respect, how to speak properly, how to be functional members of society. They are forced, through whatever means. I don't mean schools - they hardly even dare correct pupils' grammar. You get these youngsters out of these toxic atmospheres and into something that will help both them and their country. This would be a little like National Service, but with a role appropriate to the temperament and abilities of each child.

Then, after ten years, their parents meet them. They're well-spoken, functional. Their parents are shooting up drugs or doing whatever stupid things they did before, swearing, spitting, watching junk TV. The children have been saved - we've all been saved from them, too.

This does happen but only in the most extreme cases. I'd do it much more readily, to be honest. Where the parents are failures (which I would much more readily diagnose them as being) the children could be removed and be given proper parenting by the state. Yes, I did say "state" but this is not some left wing idea of state, nor would it be "far-right". Just responsible. The state is composed of individuals too. In the institutions the children would meet authority figures whom they could respect, even grow to really like. They'd probably just feel pity for their parents when they got back. But then, at least, they'd be in a position to help them rather than be ruined by them.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Paul » 16 May 2013, 13:27

How horrific it is. I know quite a few fellows who have been dispossessed (that is the reality) of their children by what amounts to feminism and co and ultimately, slatternly partners who have followed the script.

But here's a thing: I've got to know a few of the children involved who are now aged 20 or more and adults in their own right. I don't know everything about them and may tut-tut at some of what I perceive as their outlook, but to be honest I haven't seen anything too bad. Quite a handful of sons (I know the girls less, obviously I suppose) have turned out quite well indeed. One of my friend's sons has recently entered the Royal Engineers (army) whilst his younger brother (now 16) is on with an application for the Royal Navy - and he wants to be a chef. All this is because of identity with their father and encouragement, though never pressure from him - and yet they were 'brought up' by their mother. Another friend's son, of similar background, currently has three jobs.

My daughter is now aged twenty and has several friends. Two of them, sisters, have a foolish, wrecked and alcoholic mother. It's all very sad. However, both of them are working, are drink-free (in that way) and identify far more with their maritally estranged father.

What I have gathered is that many young people, whilst not succumbing to hatred or abandonment (it is their mother after all) have developed at least a certain disdain for their mothers. More so the sons maybe, but that is mainly what I see. Eventually, children grow up and yet easily remember motherly drunkeness or worse, a succession of mother's partners and general slovenly behaviour. No young man wishes to acknowledge or appreciate the loose morals of his own mother. The girls are probably the same, from a slightly different perspective. Obviously there will be exceptions - or maybe these young people I have met are the exception, but it's not necessarily as bad as what one may presume. There is a certain backlash and at least all these young people know the pitfalls and to where they lead. They see their mothers, now more or less alone, or unhappy in their relationships and somewhat damaged and scarred - their reputations at least. All these women, now aged forty-something or fifty have nothing to crow about and having made an uncomfortable bed, now have to lie in it. To some degree, seeing the 'dark side' has educated these children, uncomfortable as the lesson may be. Furthermore I see an increeasing respect and pity (of the true kind) for their fathers. Absence makes the heart grow fonder and at the same time they have now learned that their fathers are not the selfish sexists that they were portrayed as being. Quite the opposite.

My mother worked in education from 1976 until 2010. She recalls how in the 1970s, a child with only one parent at home was an absolute exception. Such people could even be single-parented because of bereavement but virtually never because of estrangement. She recalls one boy in my sister's class (born 1972) who was without a father and how everyone in class felt truly sorry for him.

Fast forward to recent times and my mother was bewildered and found it rather onerous to identify who was living with whom, what name a child should be known by (subject to alarming change), who were siblings, half siblings, and step-siblings, etc. There was the situation where various people were prohibited from collecting children from school, either legally because of injunctions or even stronger court orders, or within 'families' because of feuds and the current whims. The backdrop to all this is a fear (by my Mum and the school) of doing the wrong thing and precipitating a disaster or a legal wrong. In many cases it was long-suffering and equally bewildered grandparents who collected children from school, treading a fine line and not wishing to cause offence and maybe even violence between adult parents of twenty and thirty-something years of age.

My mother witnessed stand up fist-fights in the school yard or car-park, almost invariably between women, who cat-fought on the basis of jealousy and a custody tug-of-war and all the other dysfunctional reasons. Some grandparents have been in tears because, often unknown to them, they are suddenly prevented from collecting children from school, according to a directive from parents - shifting parents. Whilst my mother (and hopefully the school) sympathised, their hands were tied by the law and the inviolable rights of a parent - meaning the biological mother. Neither could they dare to take any gamble or go with gut instinct in case a tragedy unfolded.

Many fathers were utterly prevented from collecting their own children. Maybe in some cases this was a wise choice but in no way all of them. A look at some of the mothers leaves little to be desired anyway and it was obvious that family politics was the reason. Imagine a man knowing he would be turned away and then even viewed with suspicion if he tried to collect his own children from school. Sideways looks and mutterings among the staff. No man is going to endure that - other than the truly thuggish types who care not and who then reinforce the narrative.

You may also guess that virtually all the staff (except one lone male) were female themselves, often young and so tended to side with the mothers, even when it was plain that those mothers were less than ideal. And besides, the school once employed a young woman to attend and give 'aerobics classes' after school hours (for the girls only) who herself had changed her name by Deed Poll, had spent time until recently in a 'battered wives' refuge and moonlighted in another job............ lap-dancing! I was utterly astonished and as you can imagine this woman was far from being unattractive. Quite why she was a 'battered wife' is anyone's guess. Maybe the lap-dancing had something to do with it. Meanwhile she was attending this primary school a couple of nights a week, dressed in what can only be described as 'provocative' clothing (to any male aged over about seven!) and giving, I think, a terrible example to the young girls. At the same time she was probably lucratively paid for the activity, at least in respect of its value.

At around the same time, the headmistress, younger than me, decided to 're-invent herself' and promptly ditched her professional husband and decided then to bring up their own child alone. She then went on to establish a 'dating agency' (online and real-world) and actually targetted the many single mothers who had children at the school. You couldn't make this stuff up.

My mother knows of children who had name changes or double-barrelled additions to their name within a school term, only then to revert back to the original name the next term. It's almost unbelievable.

Looming over all of this is the spectre of the Social Services (a feared organisation and not without reason) and various special educational services administered by the local authority. Again, almost exclusively females. Lucrative posts held by bureaucrats who cannot possibly care fully, such is the scope of the problem. Being cynical, one could level even more damning accusations against these people. At the least it's all costing an absolute fortune.

Let's hope the situation is changing or about to change. I fear not and in any case, it will be too little, far too late. An entire two generations at least have been let down utterly by social policies and by the complicity of their own mentors (teachers, agencies, the authorities, ectc). Just what do you do with these people, particularly the mentors, now secure in their positions and affluent beyond their merits and who will never admit to their own failings? In fact they don't even acknowledge they have failed (one mustn't judge remember) and will stick to the same tired and discredited policies unto the end. For the ones who pretend otherwise and attempt to portray an innocent helplessness or even a reversal of attitude, we should remember their names and what they once said, as indicated on other threads on this forum. Given the amount of people however, this is a virtual impossibility.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Charlie » 16 May 2013, 22:22

Paul wrote:Just what do you do with these people, particularly the mentors, now secure in their positions and affluent beyond their merits and who will never admit to their own failings? In fact they don't even acknowledge they have failed (one mustn't judge remember) and will stick to the same tired and discredited policies unto the end.


And if anything ends up destroying this once great nation, it's hard for me to escape the idea that this will be the main reason for its collapse.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Caleb » 17 May 2013, 01:53

I'm not entirely sure what to do about this. Clearly, the current system is failing. Yet what were the solutions in the past? Ship them off to Australia? Working houses for the poor or unmarried mothers? Orphanages and other institutions? These places either served as finishing schools for criminals, or there was rampant abuse. In either situation, there was not a clearly successful outcome. To this day there is still massive fallout in countries like Ireland, or any country in the New World with an indigenous population where children were taken from their families. Every path is fraught with quite dramatic unintended consequences. It may not be a case of solving the problem. The underclass may always exist to some extent. It may be a case of finding the best way of polite society largely turning a blind eye to the underclass and how they are dealt with. The solution may be one of minimising the degree to which the underclass can run amok, but also, the degree to which dealing with them can have fall out in wider society also. Like it or not, we come from (post-)Christian societies where it's not really acceptable to just lock them up and throw away the key, cut off body parts or string them up, or drive them as gun-fodder or convicts into another land. Indeed, it's better that we're at least a little soft on crime. Who wants to live in China or Saudi Arabia?
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Grant » 17 May 2013, 08:14

Caleb, I must take exception with your "ship them off to Australia" comment. Out in the antipodes we haven't done too badly beginning with detritus of the English penal system. It's a shame the spirit that made this country a great place is sadly being eroded by political correctness and a licence for people to do whatever "turns them on". I agree totally with Gavin's comment about some form of national service. We spend millions in schools trying to correct disadvantage created at home, knowing we ( teachers) have the children for six hours a day while the poor kids are exposed to parents/friends/enemies for the rest of the time. Some form of removal from the environment that created the problem is the only solution. I yearn for a system where parents and their children would lobby for their children to be part of a system that would redress the mess created by inept parenting.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Caleb » 18 May 2013, 03:35

Grant: Australia was built by free settlers. During the convict period, it was a festering sore. The first currency in the colonies was actually rum. Modern Australia is an incredible success story, I agree, but I'd still like to see more of our convict culture purged. There are still far too many bogans in Australia.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Mike » 18 May 2013, 07:47

Caleb wrote:Modern Australia is an incredible success story, I agree, but I'd still like to see more of our convict culture purged. There are still far too many bogans in Australia.


I don't think there's much of a historical connection there, to be honest. Australia has always had a large working class, of course, but the bogan* phenomenon is fairly recent. It does seem, though, that the bogan element seems to take pride in the fact that some Australians (not as many as one would think, though) have convict ancestry. Actually, it was very indicative of the post-60s cultural shift that discovering one's convict ancestry became something of a fashion statement rather than an embarrassment.

* for non-Australians: bogan = chav, except living in the outer suburban wilderness rather than the inner city slums.
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Re: The breakdown of the family

Postby Grant » 18 May 2013, 08:26

Mike and Caleb, you must read posts more carefully before responding. I did write "beginning with the detritus of English penal system". That does not mean the entire nation was built by convicts. There was also a fair bit of tongue in the cheek!
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